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 Party Like It's 1995

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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:08 pm

_Howard wrote:
Something like two thirds of federal spending is mandatory (required by existing law) and so it continues.
I think the figure you're looking for is 87%.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:35 pm

That 87% (which is questionable) refers to the amount of spending, not the amount of the budget that is mandatory. There will be a lot of money spent on discretionary items that are deemed essential.

And that other 13% in the article? It will be spent when the employees return to work and receive retroactive pay, and when contractors receive payments to make up for any real or imagined losses they incur. By the time it's all over with, more money will be spent than would have been if the shutdown had not occurred.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:41 pm

That's what history suggests.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:06 pm

Many moons ago when my hair was long and black and Congress was fairly rational, when there was a budget impasse, everything kept running and everyone stayed at work and nobody gave a damn. Then some asshole Attorney General (under Carter, I think) said that it was not legal to continue normal operations when there was no budget and employees had to be sent home. That's when all the fun began.

But in the years since, countless laws and executive orders have diluted the effects of so-called shutdowns; there is a law that requires that military personnel be paid no matter what; there is (or at least was) a law that requires all returning federal employees to be paid retroactively for the time they were off work; etc., etc.

So all it is now is a big Washington cluster fuck that costs taxpayers money and gives the blow-dried pundits something to carp about on the idiot tube. And doesn't do anyone one bit of good.

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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:55 am

It's all theatre of course. They shut down the most visible aspects of government -- national monuments, national parks, Head Start -- in order to make the news although these don't save the government enough to pay one congressman's salary.

Everyone talks about how awful the debt is, but I haven't seen a single analysis that puts it in perspective either to other countries or historically to our own.

Nobody talks about the costs of the furloughs.

It's all theatre, and bad Kabuki theatre at that.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:51 am

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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:18 pm

This seems like a very narrowly-defined denial.
Quote :
While Freedom Partners, whose board is headed by a longtime executive of Koch Industries, has financed organizations that are pushing to defund the law, like Heritage Action and Tea Party Patriots, Freedom Partners has not advocated that. A spokesman for the group, James Davis, said it was more focused on “educating Americans around the country on the negative impacts of Obamacare.”
Source

And it's pretty easily disproven.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:37 pm

Do all these right-wing assholes think there is no one in this country with a memory? The Hertiage Foundation proposed a health insurance plan almost identical to the one we got. Forty years ago, Richard Nixon was ready to sign a very-similar bill if it passed, but Ted Kennedy killed it.

This is a Republican bill. Liberals hate it. But the current crop of Republicans in Congress will vote against anything that Obama or the Democrats favor. Hell, they have voted against their own god damn bills when Obama has spoken in favor of them.

At least I've figured out why the Congressional theatres are round: better for the continuous circle jerks.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:11 pm

Couple nights ago Ezra Klein recommended the Democrats start referring to the Affordable Care Act as "Romneycare." That's what it's patterned after.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:34 pm

For many decades, the Republicans have tried to push through a bill like Romneycare every time the Democrats brought up the subject of universal health care. In an effort to forestall yet another Democrat-led fight for universal health care, Reagan signed a law requiring emergency rooms to accept anyone who came in regardless of their financial condition. The mandatory transfer of many tens of billions from the working- and middle-class taxpayers to the insurance corporations is one of their favorite wet dreams. Their only problem Republicans have with this current law is that it has a Democrat's name on it. The Republicans are quite willing to destroy what remains of the economy just out of spite.

For years, the Republicans have refused to govern the country and have attempted - and mostly succeeded - in defeating any decent piece of legislation. They have destroyed the economy by transferring enormous amounts of wealth to the already wealthy and removing controls from the financial system, freeing them to take trillions from the people through fraudulent practices. The Fed takes money from the middle class through near-zero interest rates and gives it to banks to prop up their bottom lines. The economy is more fragile now than it was before the recent crisis and depression.

Where are the protestors? Can the younger generations not see what these dildos are doing to them? The only thing I can imagine that would have any effect at all on the GOP - and a great many of the DINOs - is millions of people taking to the streets, day after day after day. We did it when I was young and we played a big part in helping to pass the Civil Rights laws and in ending the stupid war in Viet Nam. Generations before that, the tactic was used to promote unionization and better working conditions. Where are the young people now? I hear them bitching about having to pay into Social Security to help support old farts, but I don't hear them complaining about the business practices that have driven many into poverty and continues to increase the number of poor people in the country.

<end of rant>
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:38 pm

They can't hear anything except their ear buds.

No, that's not right. They're all so cynical that they don't believe change is possible.

And... they have a point.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:57 pm

NoCoPilot wrote:
They're all so cynical that they don't believe change is possible.
I disagree. I know many people in the two generations behind mine and they are more optimistic about things improving than I am.

NoCoPilot wrote:
And... they have a point.
No, they don't. Change is possible, it's just not cheap or easy. I expect that one day, the young will rise up and raise hell, but I'm afraid that things will have become so bad by then that it may not do any good.
Perhaps Socrates was on to something:
Socrates wrote:
“Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers.”
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:36 am

Quote :
Under the new proposal, the House would vote as soon as Friday evening on a plan to raise the debt limit through Nov. 20 — the week before Thanksgiving — to create space for talks over broader budget issues. Republicans have also offered to reopen the government as soon as next week in a bill that would replace some of the deep budget cuts known as the sequester with cuts to entitlement programs, including Medicare, according to people familiar with the proposal who spoke on condition of anonymity. Replacing the sequester is a top Democratic priority, while cutting entitlement programs is a leading GOP priority. But details of the proposals were murky, and there was no clear quid pro quo linking one priority to the other.
Fuck.  I *hope* Obama tells them to go fuck themselves.  They don't get to dictate the terms of the agreement just because they have a gun to the head of the a dog.
Huffpost noticed the new ransom demand. Apparently it isn't all about Romneycare afterall, is it Boner?
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:45 pm

_Howard wrote:
The complete definition of the federal crime of treason, from Article 3 of the Constitution:
Quote :
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.
No matter how horrid Boner and his friends are, their actions do not fall within this narrow definition.
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/topoftheticket/la-na-tt-ted-cruz-shutdown-20130912,0,6574350.story
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:11 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:53 pm

It's waaaaaaaaaaay past time for a constitutional convention.

If this country wants to survive as something other than the world's largest banana republic, then some very basic changes are required.

The electorate has proven that it cannot be trusted to make sensible selections.  The elected have proven that they cannot be trusted at all. The houses of Congress have proven that they are incapable of conducting themselves in an intelligent (non-childish) manner. The Supreme Court has proven that it cannot always act with the interests of the country foremost. These very basic problems have to be addressed.

Then there's the problem of run-away capitalism. It doesn't fucking work and the economic system has to be redesigned significantly.

this rant has been brought to you by Monty Python Holy Grail
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 15, 2013 5:52 pm

_Howard wrote:
This rant has been brought to you by Monty Python Holy Grail
You must be from the Judean People's Popular Front.
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PostSubject: Re: Party Like It's 1995   Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:10 pm

NoCoPilot wrote:
You must be from the Judean People's Popular Front.
No fucking way! I'm from the People's Front of Judea. The Judean People's Popular Front is a bunch of splitters!
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