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NoCoPilot

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PostSubject: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyMon Apr 15, 2013 1:49 pm

WTF? Runners aren't a politcal target.
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_Howard
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyMon Apr 15, 2013 2:03 pm

Any crowd is a viable target.
Politics is seldom the impetus for a bombing like this.

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NoCoPilot

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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyMon Apr 15, 2013 2:14 pm

_Howard wrote:
Politics is seldom the impetus for a bombing like this.
In this country it is -- or has been.
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_Howard
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyMon Apr 15, 2013 3:59 pm

I don't agree with that. The people who are involved with these things don't seem to be bright enough to have even a basic understanding of politics, foreign or domestic. They are just a bunch of pissed off losers who use politics as an excuse for their actions.

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NoCoPilot

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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyMon Apr 15, 2013 4:23 pm

Give us some examples of random, non-political US terrorism.

Mrs. NoCoPilot and I discussed this tonight and the only example we could think of was the 1996 Atlanta Olympics bombing. And even in this case, the bomber had a message in mind, although quite insanely divorced from the event and the consequences of the bombing.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyTue Apr 16, 2013 7:18 pm

So far, nobody has stepped forward (even anonymously) to claim credit, or explain the message. I heard the Taliban specifically made a statement that they *were not* involved.

Therefore, so far, it is the first meaningless anonymous random bombing in US history -- at least since 1920.
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richard09

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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyTue Apr 16, 2013 10:48 pm

The organized muslim and leftist groups are usually quick to claim the credit for the ones they do. The ones who usually keep quiet are the home-grown right-wing terrorists and nutcases. The deafening silence suggests this is somebody's protest against income tax (or something).
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NoCoPilot

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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 7:01 am

Huh, hadn't thought of that. You think it's a Tea Party group, like Michelle Bachmann or Sharon Angle and her "Second Amendment solutions"?
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 7:04 am

richard09 wrote:
The organized muslim and leftist groups ....
This sounds wrong to my ears. Aren't most religious/cultural extremists extreme RIGHT wing???
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 8:06 am

Well, that's why I mentioned Muslim groups and leftist groups. I didn't mean "leftist Muslims".
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 8:37 am

richard09 wrote:
Well, that's why I mentioned Muslim groups and leftist groups. I didn't mean "leftist Muslims".
Yes but your construction did conflate, I suspect intentionally, "Muslim groups" and "leftist groups" when, in point of fact, religious extremism and what I would call "cultural extremism" -- forcing one's own behavioral constricts on everyone else (viz. anti-abortionists, anti-pornographers, anti-gay, anti-recreational drug use, etc.) -- is a far right trait. Leftists -- with the possible exception of the ALF Animal Liberation Front -- tend to be "live-and-let-live" advocates to whom bombing a crowd to make a point would be a nonsensical anathema.
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NoCoPilot

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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 11:11 am

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richard09

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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 5:54 pm

NoCoPilot wrote:
richard09 wrote:
Well, that's why I mentioned Muslim groups and leftist groups. I didn't mean "leftist Muslims".
Yes but your construction did conflate, I suspect intentionally, "Muslim groups" and "leftist groups" ...
Which part of "I didn't mean leftist Muslims" are you having trouble grasping?
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyWed Apr 17, 2013 7:50 pm

richard09 wrote:
Which part of "I didn't mean leftist Muslims" are you having trouble grasping?
Who said anything about "leftist Muslims"? I certainly didn't.

I was challenging you on your accusation that leftist groups plant bombs.

In American, indeed world history that is a rightist tactic.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 10:49 am

The number of "pray for Boston" type posting got on my nerves so I snapped and told some truth:

There are some seriously hypocritical motor scooters going around on this Boston crap. Of course it's a tragedy, of course our hearts go out to the people injured. But damn ya'll it's like people only give a shit if they are affluent Americans. Do you know how many people die every day? Over 153,000. That's an average of more than 1 per second. Each and every one of them a tragedy, a loss, a heartbroken family member, a future unrealized, a life force extinguished. Explain to me how these 3 people are so special they warrant all this hand-wringing and the other 150,000 who went yesterday don't.
We Americans allow our government and it's corporation to kill many. Millions. We seek a double standard that lets us start billion dollar wars over a few thousand of our people being killed but we expect no retaliation when we send drones to kill others in the night like cowards. We suck up other people's water and land and resources for our own greed. And those of us who do not participate in it directly do nothing to stop it and most of us know it's wrong. Everybody wants the cushy life, with all their disposable crap. Nobody wants to stand up and say look, the way we are living is wrong, it's unsustainable, it's gonna kill. But then everyone rushes to post condolences over shit like the Boston Marathon. I don't believe most of them. I don't believe they are doing anything other than offering platitudes and they embarrass me.
Whoever did that shit cracked. Just like the shootings and bombings before it. People crack because they are being kept in an inhumane system that produces inhumanity. That's all it can produce. Garbage in and garbage out. And nobody wants it to stop because if they did we could. We outnumber them, we the mass of people outnumber our leaders and could demand more but we are entirely too busy posting on Facebook and eating our Ben and Jerry's to do it. We could demand a system that didn't allow people to be reduced to slaves. We could demand a system that reflected our dignity as human beings but the vast majority of us are too greedy and self serving to do it. We house niggas. As long as we are one step up from the fields we take their shit and say "yes massa" and cash their little paychecks and then bend over for them even though we outnumber them ten to one. We could use our tech to make the world better instead of coming up with yet another product we must have. But we won't, because as long as we are comfortable we are compliant. And yet with all that shit we do to each other when something like yesterday happens all of a sudden everyone's all kumbaya and united. Bullshit. I call bullshit.

I'm not angry I just do not believe it and I'm not going to pretend I do and I see no advantage to being nice about it and mincing words. If anywhere close to the number of people posting something spiritual, or inspirational or whatever about Boston actually gave a rat's ass about life we'd have some serious changes going on. The emperor has no clothes and I'm not about to condone or applaud the nakedness.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:09 am

Jenni wrote:
Do you know how many people die every day? Over 153,000.
Overall? Like from old age and disease as well as accidents? That's unavoidable. Everybody dies eventually. Accidents happen. Even (to some extent) murders happen.
Jenni wrote:
We Americans allow our government and it's corporation to kill many. Millions.
Khomeini came out yesterday saying he was sad for the Boston victims but that it was hypocritical to worry about 3 victims when our drones killed so many citizens in his part of the world. Death by warfare -- even undeclared warfare -- is an entirely different kettle of fish from death by natural causes. If I had my way nobody would die on purpose.
Jenni wrote:
everyone rushes to post condolences over shit like the Boston Marathon. I don't believe most of them.
The people killed in Boston were not combatants. They didn't die of natural causes. Their deaths were senseless and stupid and, so far at least, nobody has explained why they were targeted. Outrage seems like the reasonable response.
Jenni wrote:
all of a sudden everyone's all kumbaya and united. Bullshit. I call bullshit.
Terrorist bombings are theoretically preventable. Law enforcement missed this one. Sadness, increased vigilance and a search for motives and perpetrators are all reasonable responses.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:13 am

NoCoPilot wrote:
I was challenging you on your accusation that leftist groups plant bombs.

In American, indeed world history that is a rightist tactic.
You're joking, of course. Blowing up people and things has a rich history for nutcases of all stripes. It's true that, since the Soviet Union dissolved, leftist terrorists have also melted away somewhat, probably because of lack of funding. But in world history (and I suspect in America too), leftists often planted bombs.

Revolutionary Cells

Red Army Faction

Weather Underground
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:17 am

My point is that I do not buy the display of remorse when so many stand by and letting the killing continue daily. I just don't. Call it what you want I just do not think people care as much as they claim or some shit would have been stopped by now. I think it's really really easy to post a pic but it's hard to get out and do the things that pressure governments to do what they should. I think that complacency is helped along by the privilege of those who are complacent.

As for terrorism I don't even want to hear that word- it's lies. Terrorist or rebel only depends which side you are on and what the hell do people expect when you push people to the brink. We are animals after all. But that goes back to our human systems we expect people to take abuse after abuse and never fight back and the minute you do you are seized somehow by authorities and told you are bad because you finally did what is only natural. It's a way denying our humanity and weeding out those who don't respect authority. We send machines- machines, we don't even waste manpower on them- to kill them in their beds at night. And we are honestly surprised when they work their way over here with a bomb?! Seriously? Because I'm not surprised at all. I'm not saying it's the right response- not at all- and I shouldn't have to say that. But it's an understandable response. If we are gonna take ourselves to war we need to act honorably. Declare it properly, set out goals, have an end, honor Geneva conventions, etc. Kick ass with honor if it has to be done.

There are reasons for violence and people kid themselves when they pretend it can be legislated away. We have to tackle Maslow's hierarchy one bit at a time. We know this system denies people stuff they need- that's the only way it can survive. People need to ask themselves are they really willing to do the work needed to change this for real. Because there are ways to do it, but I see no one on the scene with the balls to do it. And as long as you have emotional pleadings gun laws and warrantless wiretaps and drone strikes and not mental health care, for example, the focus will never come anywhere near where it needs to be and all forms of this bullshit will continue because as long as they keep producing the band-aids people keep buying them and the band aid producers get paid. Cures end the flow of money. "Peace" doesn't really produce. "Terrorism" and the fear mongering that follows it pays the bills.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:23 am

The groups you link -- Revolutionay Cells, Baader-Meinhoff & The Weathermen -- all hail from the fringe left and I think it's generally agreed that politics is circular, the farther you get from the middle the more fringey you get, and at some point the 'fringe left' and the 'fringe right' tend to blur into each other.

However -- and here is my point I think -- center right politics is perfectly fine with bombing abortion clinics, killing abortion providers, stockpiling assault rifles, building bunkers, and allowing schoolchildren to be mowed down to protect Second Amendment rights. Those are no longer 'fringe' beliefs on the right.

To center left politics however that's nuts.


Last edited by NoCoPilot on Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:31 am; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:26 am

Jenni wrote:
But it's an understandable response.
Has it been determined that the bombing was the work of foreign nationals? No it has not. You are leaping to conclusions which are not supportable.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:31 am

NoCoPilot wrote:
The groups you link -- Revolutionay Cells, Baader-Meinhoff & The Weathermen -- all hail from the fringe left and I think it's generally agreed that politics is circular, the farther you get from the middle the more fringey you get, and at some point the 'fringe left' and the 'fringe right' tend to blur into each other.
No true leftists would plant bombs.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:32 am

richard09 wrote:
No true leftists would plant bombs.
I edited my earlier post to be more clear -- you Scotsman you.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyThu Apr 18, 2013 11:36 am

richard09 wrote:
But in world history (and I suspect in America too), leftists often planted bombs.
I only asked you to substantiate.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyFri Apr 19, 2013 6:43 am

The suspects are looking mighty white to me, although it seems they may be muslim.
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PostSubject: Re: Boston Marathon Bombing   Boston Marathon Bombing EmptyFri Apr 19, 2013 7:12 am

Two Chechan brothers who have lived in the US for years. So far no motive uncovered, except that Chechans tend to be batshit crazy.
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